Sure is CRISPR in here.

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Wide And Nerdy

Sure is CRISPR in here.

Postby Wide And Nerdy » Thu Jan 07, 2016 1:26 pm

I know I'm probably late to the game on this one. I know its been around since 2012. But you hear stories like this all the time "scientists might have found way to cure cancer." So I probably heard about this then ignored it. But it turns out this is the real deal. And its getting better all the time.

It could cure tons of diseases and even upgrade the species. I know not to expect anything groundshaking for years but its now its "when" not "if."

I'm kind of really curious about what this is going to do to the field of ethics. What happens when a field based somewhat on the inevitability of human nature is forced to deal with the idea that human nature can be changed?

EDIT: And I know it has tons of other applications. Anything with genes can be edited. New crops, changes in species, etc. Maybe they could do something about the burmese pythons infesting Florida's swamps (sorry, that issue is literally a little close to home for me.)
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Daemian Lucifer

Re: Sure is CRISPR in here.

Postby Daemian Lucifer » Thu Jan 07, 2016 3:22 pm

Well since we are already doing it with crops,thats the first thing to play with.Though juggling genes is only the first part of.A much tougher part is finding what each combination does,and what are the useful ones.

As for human gene splicing,thats at least decades away.Not just because of ethics,but because no one will play with human genes without knowing precisely what each gene combination does.
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Wide And Nerdy

Re: Sure is CRISPR in here.

Postby Wide And Nerdy » Thu Jan 07, 2016 3:49 pm

Daemian Lucifer wrote:Well since we are already doing it with crops,thats the first thing to play with.Though juggling genes is only the first part of.A much tougher part is finding what each combination does,and what are the useful ones.

As for human gene splicing,thats at least decades away.Not just because of ethics,but because no one will play with human genes without knowing precisely what each gene combination does.


I'm really hoping they'll push faster than that with fatal conditions and possibly congenital defects. There's also news that they can now use it for temporarily muting gene expression, temp blocking of receptors, and targeting payloads of chemicals. That last one could be a cure for cancer right there and given that its just tracking, I'd think thats something we could move on sooner.
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Daemian Lucifer

Re: Sure is CRISPR in here.

Postby Daemian Lucifer » Thu Jan 07, 2016 4:17 pm

Wide And Nerdy wrote:I'm really hoping they'll push faster than that with fatal conditions and possibly congenital defects.


While technically we already know how to cure certain genetic diseases,the problem is that doing so would require a procedure to happen during very early fetus development,which is not viable.
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Wide And Nerdy

Re: Sure is CRISPR in here.

Postby Wide And Nerdy » Thu Jan 07, 2016 4:28 pm

Daemian Lucifer wrote:
Wide And Nerdy wrote:I'm really hoping they'll push faster than that with fatal conditions and possibly congenital defects.


While technically we already know how to cure certain genetic diseases,the problem is that doing so would require a procedure to happen during very early fetus development,which is not viable.


I thought the point was that we could do these edits in adults now.
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Daemian Lucifer

Re: Sure is CRISPR in here.

Postby Daemian Lucifer » Thu Jan 07, 2016 4:51 pm

Wide And Nerdy wrote:I thought the point was that we could do these edits in adults now.


That would require you to deal with billions of cells.While thats technically possible,you cant really do it.Removing a localized tumor is doable,since its just a single small mass of cells.But genetic diseases affect practically your whole body.
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dudecon
Location: Camarillo, CA
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Re: Sure is CRISPR in here.

Postby dudecon » Thu Jan 07, 2016 8:57 pm

Wide And Nerdy wrote:
Daemian Lucifer wrote:While technically we already know how to cure certain genetic diseases,the problem is that doing so would require a procedure to happen during very early fetus development,which is not viable.
I thought the point was that we could do these edits in adults now.
So, CRISPR is capable of altering gene sequences, but it doesn't replicate and deliver those sequences.
The human body, like all organisms, is very protective of its genetic material, so even after making billions of copies of this genetic information, you would need to deliver it to the individual cells.

So what about engineering viruses to deliver the genetic material? They already deliver snippets of genetic material to cells, so can't we just get a genetic sample, modify it, and then put it in a virus and intentionally infect the patient? The problem is, viruses don't remove the old genetic material, nor do they usually deliver DNA (except for retroviruses). But, imagine that you could, somehow get a virus to destroy the unwanted genetic material, and deliver the new stuff. The immune system would see this invasion, and fight it off, resulting in (at best) a partial transcription. The immune system also kill off the altered cells as well, with the end result of simply making the patient very ill.

This is what makes gene therapy so difficult. You have to update the immune system, and all the cells in the body within a few hours of each other, or you get a civil war which is indistinguishable from a life-threatening viral infection. And once you have the technology to do that, you also have the capacity to create a completely lethal viral weapon.

Along with the fundamental difficulty, this capacity for weaponizing retroviral technologies is another major factor in the glacial speed of genetic technology development.
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Supahewok

Re: Sure is CRISPR in here.

Postby Supahewok » Thu Jan 07, 2016 9:39 pm

Wasn't it a virus to cure cancer that kicked off the last I Am Legend movie?
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Wide And Nerdy

Re: Sure is CRISPR in here.

Postby Wide And Nerdy » Fri Jan 08, 2016 2:58 am

dudecon wrote:
Wide And Nerdy wrote:
Daemian Lucifer wrote:While technically we already know how to cure certain genetic diseases,the problem is that doing so would require a procedure to happen during very early fetus development,which is not viable.
I thought the point was that we could do these edits in adults now.
So, CRISPR is capable of altering gene sequences, but it doesn't replicate and deliver those sequences.
The human body, like all organisms, is very protective of its genetic material, so even after making billions of copies of this genetic information, you would need to deliver it to the individual cells.

So what about engineering viruses to deliver the genetic material? They already deliver snippets of genetic material to cells, so can't we just get a genetic sample, modify it, and then put it in a virus and intentionally infect the patient? The problem is, viruses don't remove the old genetic material, nor do they usually deliver DNA (except for retroviruses). But, imagine that you could, somehow get a virus to destroy the unwanted genetic material, and deliver the new stuff. The immune system would see this invasion, and fight it off, resulting in (at best) a partial transcription. The immune system also kill off the altered cells as well, with the end result of simply making the patient very ill.

This is what makes gene therapy so difficult. You have to update the immune system, and all the cells in the body within a few hours of each other, or you get a civil war which is indistinguishable from a life-threatening viral infection. And once you have the technology to do that, you also have the capacity to create a completely lethal viral weapon.

Along with the fundamental difficulty, this capacity for weaponizing retroviral technologies is another major factor in the glacial speed of genetic technology development.


Yeah I don't know what I was thinking. The articles I read were so excited but there is still some really exciting potential. Someone has already figured out how to use CRISPR to suppress gene expression. Supposedly it could be used for tracking too. We could switch off some individual genes in adults and are linked to a bunch of stuff.

Could always use CRISPR to make a designer clone and someday put your brain in that.
Fists

Re: Sure is CRISPR in here.

Postby Fists » Sun Mar 06, 2016 2:18 pm

Wide And Nerdy wrote:
dudecon wrote:
Wide And Nerdy wrote:I thought the point was that we could do these edits in adults now.
So, CRISPR is capable of altering gene sequences, but it doesn't replicate and deliver those sequences.
The human body, like all organisms, is very protective of its genetic material, so even after making billions of copies of this genetic information, you would need to deliver it to the individual cells.

So what about engineering viruses to deliver the genetic material? They already deliver snippets of genetic material to cells, so can't we just get a genetic sample, modify it, and then put it in a virus and intentionally infect the patient? The problem is, viruses don't remove the old genetic material, nor do they usually deliver DNA (except for retroviruses). But, imagine that you could, somehow get a virus to destroy the unwanted genetic material, and deliver the new stuff. The immune system would see this invasion, and fight it off, resulting in (at best) a partial transcription. The immune system also kill off the altered cells as well, with the end result of simply making the patient very ill.

This is what makes gene therapy so difficult. You have to update the immune system, and all the cells in the body within a few hours of each other, or you get a civil war which is indistinguishable from a life-threatening viral infection. And once you have the technology to do that, you also have the capacity to create a completely lethal viral weapon.

Along with the fundamental difficulty, this capacity for weaponizing retroviral technologies is another major factor in the glacial speed of genetic technology development.


Yeah I don't know what I was thinking. The articles I read were so excited but there is still some really exciting potential. Someone has already figured out how to use CRISPR to suppress gene expression. Supposedly it could be used for tracking too. We could switch off some individual genes in adults and are linked to a bunch of stuff.

Could always use CRISPR to make a designer clone and someday put your brain in that.


So, old thread but dropped by the forums and saw this, figured I'd throw a little more info out there.

There are lots of articles out there that do refer to using CRISPR based gene editing 'in' adults so not unreasonable to think that we're getting close. As dudecon said, getting complete or even majority transformation will be very difficult in a developed organism so real in vivo medical use will probably only be for cases where achieving some basic level of functionality would be a worth-while improvement, maybe metabolic diseases/enzyme deficiencies like phenylketonuria.

What those articles are generally referring to though is combining CRISPR with our fairly well developed knowledge of bone marrow transplants, if you're familiar with leukemia treatment you know we can already replace a person's complete blood cell lineage by sterilisation by chemo therapy followed by a transplant of healthier marrow cells. Using CRISPR they should be able to extract marrow from a patient with a blood disease (sickle cell anaemia, HIV etc.), modify it to remove the problem genes or introduce resistance genes, carry out chemotherapy on the patient then transplant the improved cell line back into the patient. Still a few year minimum off clinical applications but since these diseases already require a lot of ongoing hospital care they're good candidates for a process that's going to involve that much stress.

Links:
https://www.newscientist.com/article/dn ... e-picture/
http://www.abc.net.au/radionational/pro ... es/7200612
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dudecon
Location: Camarillo, CA
Contact:

Re: Sure is CRISPR in here.

Postby dudecon » Mon Mar 07, 2016 7:56 pm

Fists wrote:...What those articles are generally referring to though is combining CRISPR with our fairly well developed knowledge of bone marrow transplants, if you're familiar with leukemia treatment you know we can already replace a person's complete blood cell lineage by sterilization by chemo therapy followed by a transplant of healthier marrow cells. Using CRISPR they should be able to extract marrow from a patient with a blood disease (sickle cell anemia, HIV etc.), modify it to remove the problem genes or introduce resistance genes, carry out chemotherapy on the patient then transplant the improved cell line back into the patient. Still a few year minimum off clinical applications but since these diseases already require a lot of ongoing hospital care they're good candidates for a process that's going to involve that much stress.

Links:
https://www.newscientist.com/article/dn ... e-picture/
http://www.abc.net.au/radionational/pro ... es/7200612
Fascinating. My step-mother died from leukemia. Amazing how we keep coming up with new ways to keep people alive. I wonder if you could do whole organ gene-mod cloning and transplants further down the road.
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Daemian Lucifer

Re: Sure is CRISPR in here.

Postby Daemian Lucifer » Tue Mar 14, 2017 10:27 am

We found a use for crispr:Designing actual alien life here on earth.Scientists have finally made a bacteria with dna based on six bases instead of the regular four.While similar things were created earlier,when they first made the two new bases,this is the first actually stable organism that can live for as long as it receives the two artificial bases.The new base pair currently does nothing else than ensuring that the bacteria will die if not fed these compounds.This alone opens up an interesting possibilities for medicine(first thing that comes to mind is cancer killing bacteria)and pest control.So yay for science!
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Wide And Nerdy

Re: Sure is CRISPR in here.

Postby Wide And Nerdy » Tue Mar 14, 2017 2:29 pm

Daemian Lucifer wrote:We found a use for crispr:Designing actual alien life here on earth.Scientists have finally made a bacteria with dna based on six bases instead of the regular four.While similar things were created earlier,when they first made the two new bases,this is the first actually stable organism that can live for as long as it receives the two artificial bases.The new base pair currently does nothing else than ensuring that the bacteria will die if not fed these compounds.This alone opens up an interesting possibilities for medicine(first thing that comes to mind is cancer killing bacteria)and pest control.So yay for science!


In other words, we can do that cancer cure from I Am Legend without triggering the Zombie Apocalypse?

This is my non serious way of saying thats actually pretty awesome.

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