Off topic (is cool) thread

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Daemian Lucifer

Off topic (is cool) thread

Postby Daemian Lucifer » Tue Jun 16, 2015 6:43 am

So instead of creating a new topic every time you want to say something random that will have a couple of replies at most,why not have a single thread for it all.

Anyway,Im sure most are already familiar with this,but for those that arent:Here is why having a dlc in your car is a bad idea.
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Thomas

Re: Off topic (is cool) thread

Postby Thomas » Tue Jun 16, 2015 10:30 am

Really good idea for a thread :) That situation is both horrifying, if companies continue to parody themselves so well with their own actions The Onion is going to go out of business
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Supahewok

Re: Off topic (is cool) thread

Postby Supahewok » Tue Jun 16, 2015 2:30 pm

Uh... that's got to be illegal on some level, right? Surely they can't charge extra for basic safety features?
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dudecon
Location: Camarillo, CA. Paul Spooner IRL & blog comments
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Re: Off topic (is cool) thread

Postby dudecon » Tue Jun 16, 2015 4:23 pm

Supahewok wrote:Uh... that's got to be illegal on some level, right? Surely they can't charge extra for basic safety features?
No! The politics! It's too much!
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Sudanna

Re: Off topic (is cool) thread

Postby Sudanna » Tue Jun 16, 2015 5:19 pm

It's not a basic safety feature, is the thing. Brakes are a basic safety feature. This is a quite fancy safety feature. And I, personally, actively would not want it or anything similar, so I'm glad they're optional. Even passenger-side airbags are often optional.
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Daemian Lucifer

Re: Off topic (is cool) thread

Postby Daemian Lucifer » Tue Jun 16, 2015 6:21 pm

Nalyd wrote:It's not a basic safety feature, is the thing. Brakes are a basic safety feature. This is a quite fancy safety feature. And I, personally, actively would not want it or anything similar, so I'm glad they're optional. Even passenger-side airbags are often optional.


Ive seen old cars that have no seat belts,because those were optional at one time.Safety margins for cars get updated once in a while.
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JJR

Re: Off topic (is cool) thread

Postby JJR » Tue Jun 16, 2015 6:26 pm

Nalyd wrote:It's not a basic safety feature, is the thing. Brakes are a basic safety feature. This is a quite fancy safety feature. And I, personally, actively would not want it or anything similar, so I'm glad they're optional. Even passenger-side airbags are often optional.

I think the problem is that if someone picks the model with self driving features you'd expect them to include the relevant safety features. A parallel could be paying extra for a DAB radio in your car with another charge to have the wires rubber coated, or paying for aircon but with an extra charge to have the air intake away from the engine's exhaust. Make fancy stuff optional but make sure that fancy stuff is actually safe.
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Thomas

Re: Off topic (is cool) thread

Postby Thomas » Tue Jun 16, 2015 6:45 pm

The thing that would be make or break for me is whether the car is meant to park itself.

If the idea is you tell the car to park and it does, then not including the "don't run over pedestrians" feature seems like lunacy. If the whole point is encouraging drivers to switch off and let go of control of the car then you can't have a feature that makes that safe as an "optional extra".

On the other hand if it's just a device that makes the car brake if it's about to hit a wall, then the driver would still be looking and in control so it's not that big a deal
Steve C

Re: Off topic (is cool) thread

Postby Steve C » Wed Jun 17, 2015 12:11 am

If a self driving and unoccupied car kills someone... who is to blame? The owner? The manufacturer? What if you are a passenger in a self-driving taxi?
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Thomas

Re: Off topic (is cool) thread

Postby Thomas » Wed Jun 17, 2015 12:33 am

That's going to be an interesting question. I think we're probably going to be a long way off self-driving unoccupied cars though. I guess it doesn't have to be anyones? But if its someones it'd be the manufacturer for writing code that wasn't good enough.

Even if it's not policed self-driving cars will turn car safety into something almost entirely statistically measurable though. If you make the best cars with the best software you will have a lower percentage of road accidents each year.
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Humanoid

Re: Off topic (is cool) thread

Postby Humanoid » Wed Jun 17, 2015 2:23 am

I suspect that for the foreseeable future even after fully autonomous driving is introduced, the law will still require a 'driver' to be at the controls 100% of the time, and probably require them to be fully licenced as per a 'normal' vehicle, and this person would be nominally responsible for it.

The idea kinda defeats the point of the invention for someone like me, who has never driven a car in their lifetime, but I can see where it's coming from. Taken to its logical extreme, it may be that fully autonomous cars will never co-exist with the concept of humans driving cars, ever: there's some sense to say that if one vehicle is driven by a robot, all other vehicles sharing the road with it should be too.
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Thomas

Re: Off topic (is cool) thread

Postby Thomas » Wed Jun 17, 2015 8:12 am

That's how I see it playing out. Humans behind the wheel until we reach the point where all cars are self-driving. And to be fair when all cars are self-driving it's unlikely the programming will almost ever need someone to take the wheel, whereas when humans can still drive erratic situations are still likely to pop up fairly frequently.
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grahams_xwing
Location: Mansfield, UK

Re: Off topic (is cool) thread

Postby grahams_xwing » Wed Jun 17, 2015 8:33 am

Humanoid wrote:I suspect that for the foreseeable future even after fully autonomous driving is introduced, the law will still require a 'driver' to be at the controls 100% of the time, and probably require them to be fully licenced as per a 'normal' vehicle, and this person would be nominally responsible for it.

The idea kinda defeats the point of the invention for someone like me, who has never driven a car in their lifetime, but I can see where it's coming from. Taken to its logical extreme, it may be that fully autonomous cars will never co-exist with the concept of humans driving cars, ever: there's some sense to say that if one vehicle is driven by a robot, all other vehicles sharing the road with it should be too.



If I owned a self driving car, i'd be worried about certain types of drivers deliberately 'targeting' them.

Say 19 year old British teenager 'Steve' is driving his 15 year old clapped out Fiat Uno and he sees a £xx,xxx worth of driverless car trundling (probably at a prescribed speed a % of the actual limit) in front of him and he decides, that with no one about to see it, he'll just give it a nudge into a streetlight or road sign...

Sure, they'll be camera'd up the waazoo but still....

What of the highjacking risk?

Also, moving uprights pedestrians might be easy to tag and avoid using LADAR(?) or some such system, but what about a prone figure in the road, wearing black on a dark road?

So many safety considerations left to work out. decades of legal red tape... or specific roads on closed estates or highways which are controlled somehow.

Anyway.. I LOVE driving (and for the Americans, - driving shift, I'll have (pseudo) control of the engine revs thankyou), you can prize my car keys from my cold dead hands, but not before!
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4th Dimension

Re: Off topic (is cool) thread

Postby 4th Dimension » Wed Jun 17, 2015 11:18 am

Or we could do it the way some SF novels handle that concept. You can still drive but there is a lot of techno magic between your input and what gets sent to the actual controls, because the car itself watches it's suroundings and the road conditions and is ajusting your input and preventing you from endangering yourself or others. Als with this kind of solution ALL road viehicles MUST use such systems and deliberatly disabling or tampering with the system is a capital offence since the only reason you migth do this is to endanger other people on the road. This way you get the expirience of driving with safety.

Of course this would require the auto automation technology to mature so it's unlikely to appear in shrot or even medium term.

LIDAR is laser based radar so I doubit black materials would absorb most of the laser energy at the wavelengths where they operate.

Short term I expect tech like aforementioned auto parking (the car can detect parking space with cameras and obstacles with other sensors and park) and some safety features that monitor the road in front or to the sides of the viehicle and either emit warning sounds or try to brake in order to help prevent an accident. But all these solutions would be disableable and probably stop functioning in certain conditions (auto parking might stop or refuse to function if you are engaging it while moving).
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Daemian Lucifer

Re: Off topic (is cool) thread

Postby Daemian Lucifer » Wed Jun 17, 2015 1:05 pm

So Ive noticed an interesting trend in science fiction:
Retro futuristic(the future of the 50s,aka fallout stuff)is often based somewhere in the usa.But steam punk often has london(or england if its more broad)as its main location.Why is that?
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Sudanna

Re: Off topic (is cool) thread

Postby Sudanna » Wed Jun 17, 2015 1:23 pm

England ruled the world in the 1800s. America ruled it in the 1950s.
Vulture

Re: Off topic (is cool) thread

Postby Vulture » Wed Jun 17, 2015 1:30 pm

It's probably just because of the actual history of the (implied) period. Steampunk does tend to a late industrial revolution vibe (which started in Britain), and tends to be mid-late 19th century. The iconic English images of the time are industrial progress, Sherlock Holmes and the depressing stories of Charles Dickens. Plus the British army of the Raj, Zulu, and pith-helmeted Victorian explorers looking for the source of the Nile and Phileas Fogg.

The iconic US images of the same period are the wild west, wars with native Americans, the civil war, the California gold rush.

Steam punk stories tend to be about technological progress and exploring new frontiers. While the US has the new frontiers part, it is much more a low tech, wagon train sort of feel. It's not the obvious setting for a story about shiny, advanced technology; it kind of feels more natural to set such stories in the place where that sort of innovation was already happening, which was western Europe for the most part. After all, the idea of steampunk is really taking 19th century technology and using it to do things that wouldn't have occurred to people at the time, or stretching reality and allowing stuff that isn't possible, but sounds like it might be, The real world starting point that you are branching off from is in fact the innovations of the European capitals of that period; established cities that have the industrial base for the kind of steam punk concepts.

The dominant images of the US of the time don't really put me in mind of a solid industrial base and scientific progress...


(As for the 50's being US, well, I've just mentioned in the fallout thread that it is probably because thanks to TV, there is a very well defined - if fictional - idea of the 50s in the US that is shared around much of the world. No other countries culture from that period is as instantly recognisable).
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Thomas

Re: Off topic (is cool) thread

Postby Thomas » Wed Jun 17, 2015 1:33 pm

I actually think those styles are designed around those places in that time period rather than the other way round.

Steampunk has a lot of Victorian design and influence. Top-hats monocle's, the whole idea of steam. The UK was the centre of the industrial revolution that made steam engines a thing and they were the world power (and presumably dominant cultural influencer?) in the victorian age. I wouldn't be really able to describe what the USA was like around that time.

Likewise the US was/is the world power and dominant cultural power for the retro-futuristic time scope and it's all about the weird way they handled the cold war and red scare and advertising etc.

50's Britain was super bleak, it was when we finally lost the colonial attitude and became cynical. We hit the economic low from the war and in many ways conditions in the UK during the 50's were actually worse than conditions during the war (more food was rationed after the war than before it). Our media about the cold war time period is suitably cynical, cold war literature about spies who have lost all belief in anything, the secret service riddled with spies. Dystopian futures with tyrannical governments, 1984 style.

And 50's Eastern Europe is all about sovietism in culture now right? I haven't read a whole lot of modernish eastern european literature/films etc but I bet it's generally quiet stoic and grim when taking things from that time period? Like I imagine sci-fi based on 50's eastern europe results in sci-fi like STALKER and and Metro 2033
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grahams_xwing
Location: Mansfield, UK

Re: Off topic (is cool) thread

Postby grahams_xwing » Wed Jun 17, 2015 1:51 pm

Vulture wrote:Steam punk stories tend to be about technological progress and exploring new frontiers. While the US has the new frontiers part, it is much more a low tech, wagon train sort of feel.


tell that to the writers of Wild Wild West ;)
Vulture

Re: Off topic (is cool) thread

Postby Vulture » Wed Jun 17, 2015 2:22 pm

grahams_xwing wrote:
Vulture wrote:Steam punk stories tend to be about technological progress and exploring new frontiers. While the US has the new frontiers part, it is much more a low tech, wagon train sort of feel.


tell that to the writers of Wild Wild West ;)


:)

That just means they avoided the usual cliches and came up with a more unusual setting. Nothing says steampunk *has* to have a Victorian England setting, and any setting can work if you put the effort in to making it work. But the first cliche the brain jumps to is Victorian England.

One good piece of writing advice I once read was when coming up with ideas for what to do in any situation, write a list of possible ideas, and throw away the first five since they will probably be cliches. After that you might come up with something genuinely creative.
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Daemian Lucifer

Re: Off topic (is cool) thread

Postby Daemian Lucifer » Wed Jun 17, 2015 2:24 pm

Vulture wrote:
grahams_xwing wrote:
Vulture wrote:Steam punk stories tend to be about technological progress and exploring new frontiers. While the US has the new frontiers part, it is much more a low tech, wagon train sort of feel.


tell that to the writers of Wild Wild West ;)


:)

That just means they avoided the usual cliches and came up with a more unusual setting. Nothing says steampunk *has* to have a Victorian England setting, and any setting can work if you put the effort in to making it work.


You are now speaking theoretically,right?Because www didnt really work.
Vulture

Re: Off topic (is cool) thread

Postby Vulture » Wed Jun 17, 2015 2:33 pm

Daemian Lucifer wrote:
You are now speaking theoretically,right?Because www didnt really work.



Yeah, theoretically - WWW wasn't the best. The actual level of technology they ended up with was a massive ass-pull that wasn't justified by the rules of the game (even in comedy, you have to stick to certain internal rules to make it plausible unless you are going for absurdism). It *could* have worked if done well. But....
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JJR

Re: Off topic (is cool) thread

Postby JJR » Wed Jun 17, 2015 3:14 pm

There's also the argument of where the industrial revolution had the biggest cultural significance. The UK had been a cultural powerhouse for centuries while the US didn't come in to global artistic significance until around 1850 with the first Great American Novels and the birth of the Hudson River School (please correct me if I'm wrong art historians). Due to this British industrialisation had more articles, novels, paintings, plays, photographs etc. which had a larger impact on modern culture than the young, inexperienced, less powerful US.

You also have to consider that most steampunk games are quite campy and when you deal with US industrialisation you pretty much have to see its intertwined history with slavery and things can dark very quickly. British industrialisation on the other hand was post-slavery and it's much easier to make something light hearted about the plight of factory workers than of slaves. Britain was certainly still committing atrocities but British culture has a very odd love/hate relationship with memories of the empire meaning it's a lot less controversial than American culture's memory of slavery.
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ChristopherT
Location: New England, USA

Re: Off topic (is cool) thread

Postby ChristopherT » Fri Jun 19, 2015 5:33 am

I looked for a few pages back, but I couldn't find anything about comics, so, this seems like an okay topic for this? (if there is a topic somewhere past the first few pages, sorry, I have this old built in thing where I don't feel comfortable digging through year old topics to start a new conversation in, but that's based on past boards I've been on, so.)

So, Marvel's NEW, Secret Wars, Runaways first issue came out, and being a fan of the first two runs, I was interested in seeing what this different take was like. I feel oddly self aware of not liking it. Every complaint/annoyance I have against it, I can easily see being something that someone could like or even adore, or at the very least defend. And, that seems weird. Like the students have this salute, that is copied from the Hunger Games, but with two fingers instead of three(?), with an oath, "Only the strong will survive." And I loath it, but, I also understand how someone could find it to be a cute homage to Hunger Games, and Hunger Games could be something that someone likes, and they find the link awesome, I just, really, really don't.

Pixie's here, yeah! But, then her listed powers are "wrong". It's an alternate universe, so, really anything goes, it's just, they have her powers listed as Flight and Teleportation, and that's kind of like listing Wolverine's powers as Enhanced Senses and Adamantium bones. It's not entirely wrong, but it misses something of the character. For those who don't know Pixie from X-Men, she has pixie wings so she can fly, and her main power is that she can expel pixie dust that causes serious hallucinations, the teleportation part is a magic spell she learned from Illyana some time after she ripped a bit of Pixie's soul out from the girl. But, it's an alternate universe so...?

The story seems so bare bones and run of the mill to me, with characters fighting in the hall because they don't like each other, bystanders getting in the way, and all of them sent to detention. Where, once they get out, and arrive to a meeting to pick teams for a finals test, they of course are all lumped into the final team as a punishment. And ugh, I've seen this already. BUT, yeah, okay, it's a simple story, that is really only going to serve as a way to get these characters together, get them interacting, and used as a spring board for the rest of the series, this is hardly worth caring about, because it should be over and done with quickly, because the story should really be starting once they get beyond this point. But still...ugh, couldn't they put a little more effort into it?

There are other smaller annoyances I have with it. Overall I don't think it's a bad comic, very common story though (thus far), and I'm really planning on getting the next two or three issues to see where/how the story goes, once it kicks off, and gets past the setup. Though, I do have this thing, where when reading people defending the title, talking about how this is just another group of runaways, so it fits...there's part of me that wants to mock this comic as "the Dropouts" because running away from home is kind of a thing, but I'm not really familiar with the idea of "running away" from school. That's more of a dropout thing? So, -shrug-, Next Time, on the Dropouts, Molly continues to be overly annoying and childish, Jubilee continues to be a "teenage dirtbag" (the comic's description of her), Frostbite continues to be a tryhard (my description, that makes me groan just reading it, never to be used again), and Sho or that kid with glasses continues to build %&@! - cause building things is dumb, cool kids build shit.
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Supahewok

Re: Off topic (is cool) thread

Postby Supahewok » Fri Jun 19, 2015 6:41 am

This thread, I think, is mainly for little newsbits or info bites that aren't worth their own thread. If you think that comics is something you'll want to talk about on a regular basis, (even if that regularity is only monthly) you should probably start a comics thread.

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