Doctor Who?

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Thomas

Re: Doctor Who?

Postby Thomas » Mon Sep 21, 2015 5:24 pm

I don't think that's it, because the Tardis got destroyed too. There's going to be a time reset.

Seriously strong episode there. I really hope the series can deliver on all this now (I hope its going to be one long story arc, but sadly I'm pretty sure that's not the case. At the very least I know Moffat hasn't written all the episodes and some are 'two-parters' but I'd love this to be a long arc).

The tone has shifted again. It's a lot more sci-fi now, which made the terrible effects endearing instead of bad. It got more Moffatian again towards the middle, but it was mixed in with a lot of other stuff.

Weirdly (and fantastically), one of the strongest influences was Star Wars? They had the cantina scene, then they introduced a planet using the Star Wars text, and then they sidewiped to another scene. I think there was more stuff that I didn't catch too. I really like that and I hope they keep it throughout.

And then there was all the nostalgia, but very comfortably used. Normally in the Moffat era it feels like pure fanservice*, but this felt like it was more comfortable and integrated. Hearing the Doctor's old speeches was great and it felt like it was demonstrating the history between the two and long standing struggle. I like the idea that before Davros dies he wants one last argument on the futility of compassion with his greatest nemesis. It's going to be great too if his greatest shame turns out to be not abandoning that child, although if that's the case they totally faked me out because I really believe he did it.

Clara teaching was fun, Clara trying her hand at being the Doctor was fun. She was a little less wacky too and its getting easier to pin down who Clara is. Missy was fun (and DL absolutely called how it would happen =D) and fun enough that I'll forgive them calling her Missy instead of Master, although I still think they were wrong in that decision.

All very good. I hope they don't mess it up.

*Sorry for the controversial choice of word there :p
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Daemian Lucifer

Re: Doctor Who?

Postby Daemian Lucifer » Sun Sep 27, 2015 5:34 pm

The clara and missy show needs to be a thing."One is a tough woman in a leather jacket,and the other one wields a pointy stick!"

The shades are stupid.More Matt Smith than Capaldi.Oh well,I guess I could get used to them.
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Daemian Lucifer

Re: Doctor Who?

Postby Daemian Lucifer » Sun Oct 11, 2015 9:14 am

Well,this season has started off strong.Not only good setups,but good resolutions as well.And that extra terrestrial really has a good design,I hope we will see more of them(though not too much).Also seems to be telepathic,because no way was he going to sound like that with that weird mouth.Im talking about the fisher king of course,not the sniveling undertaker.

The glasses are still stupid though.But I liked the "dont go native" in the first part.
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4th Dimension

Re: Doctor Who?

Postby 4th Dimension » Sun Oct 11, 2015 12:42 pm

I liked that it wasn't a simple monster of the week but that it introduced a nice time travel mind screw idea. I'd like if DW did more episodes like that.
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Daemian Lucifer

Re: Doctor Who?

Postby Daemian Lucifer » Sun Oct 11, 2015 1:06 pm

Now that I think about the doctors plan,I think this isnt a case of a perfect stable loop.He basically decided to create a hologram that would scare everyone shitless in order to make himself create a hologram that would scare everyone shitless.In a perfect loop,he would simply create a normal hologram to inform himself of what to do.

So my theory is that he actually did die,then went in the future as an actual em ghost,clara found out,forced him to change things(probably minutes before her actual death),but in order to not irk the reality eating gargoyles,he created a hologram of himself as a ghost,and that started this whole loop thing.
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4th Dimension

Re: Doctor Who?

Postby 4th Dimension » Sun Oct 11, 2015 3:35 pm

So as long as reality is preserved from subjective perspective (all actors see what they need to see/feel) it doesn't have to fit physically and objectively. Basically reality cares not if it's a ghost or a hologram, as long as all sentient observers are fooled. It sounds Warhammer 40kish clap your hands if you believe reality in a way.
Steve C

Re: Doctor Who?

Postby Steve C » Sun Oct 11, 2015 7:08 pm

The end of the last season fell flat with "Pink dies" for me for the reasons illustrated in this episode. The Doctor could have saved Pink and faked his death. He can always go back in time, save someone and fake their death to preserve the timeline. The whole Architect heist episode proved that.

There were a couple of fairly large plot holes in this episode too. O'Donel died in the past. Her 'ghost' should have been around for as long as the undertaker's. I put sarcastic quotes around 'ghost' as that was not technobabbled enough for me. Plus everyone was a little too scared of the ghosts after their limitations were discovered. Oh no! He's got a chair! He might bruise someone with it! Oh no! A bunch of them are insubstantially blocking my path! I can't run through them because that's too SPOOKY for me! That one has an axe he can barely lift! If only the chair didn't have space cooties on it I could use it to knock the axe swings.

Then there was the whole invasion of Earth. The big-bad faked his death so he could set up a relay system to point others to Earth. Convoluted enough? He could have just vaguely threatened the undertaker into taking him to a world ripe for conquest if that's all he wanted. He could have brought his fleet with him too.

This season so far is still 10x better than last season.
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Daemian Lucifer

Re: Doctor Who?

Postby Daemian Lucifer » Sun Oct 11, 2015 7:25 pm

Steve C wrote:The end of the last season fell flat with "Pink dies" for me for the reasons illustrated in this episode. The Doctor could have saved Pink and faked his death. He can always go back in time, save someone and fake their death to preserve the timeline. The whole Architect heist episode proved that.


Davros explained that perfectly in the stole earth episodes.Doctor is sending others to their deaths so that he can live.And basically faking death only works for him.If he tries it with others,it doesnt end well.Unless it does.But usually it doesnt.
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Daemian Lucifer

Re: Doctor Who?

Postby Daemian Lucifer » Sun Oct 18, 2015 1:50 pm

So along with "the doctor always lies" I think we can also say that "the doctor never learns".And this time he did it on purpose.

Also,I accept this episode as the actual prequel to highlander.Which was a movie without any sequels whatsoever.
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4th Dimension

Re: Doctor Who?

Postby 4th Dimension » Mon Oct 26, 2015 10:28 pm

That change at the end of the episode kind of didn't work for me. So there.
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4th Dimension

Re: Doctor Who?

Postby 4th Dimension » Thu Nov 05, 2015 7:45 am

This zygon episode really didn't do anything for me. It's full of stupid decisions and mostly lacks energy. I was really bored throughout.
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Ringwraith

Re: Doctor Who?

Postby Ringwraith » Thu Nov 05, 2015 10:07 am

Yeah, there's a bunch of "people with guns do nothing but stare".
It's building in something though, hopefully, considering the last scene and its ambiguity.
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Daemian Lucifer

Re: Doctor Who?

Postby Daemian Lucifer » Thu Nov 05, 2015 11:01 am

Ringwraith wrote:Yeah, there's a bunch of "people with guns do nothing but stare".


I really hated that scene.And I generally hate how idiotic people act when they know shapeshifters are amongst them.Especially when said people are TRAINED TO DEAL WITH STUFF LIKE THAT.Ugh!On the other hand,"unit is useless" is a common thing on this show.
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Ringwraith

Re: Doctor Who?

Postby Ringwraith » Thu Nov 05, 2015 11:57 am

It's usually restricted to "UNIT is too busy squabbling with itself" or off-screen direct response incompetence most of the time though.

You know it's bad when you're hoping for some terrible handwave-y explanation of 'messing with people's minds' or something to crop up.
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4th Dimension

Re: Doctor Who?

Postby 4th Dimension » Thu Nov 05, 2015 12:01 pm

Even the shapeshifters are dumb as fuck. I mean that shapeshifter that impersonated the old lady didn't even try to interrogate the old lady to find out basic things form her like her son's birthday and such. And still the moron went with her.

And it was glaringly obvious Clara was not Clara, especially once she started asking about weapons.
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Ringwraith

Re: Doctor Who?

Postby Ringwraith » Thu Nov 05, 2015 4:18 pm

I dunno, it sort of worked for possibly the wrong reasons as they've fumbled Clara's writing so much before. She had an entire series of being little more than a plot device, after all.
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Daemian Lucifer

Re: Doctor Who?

Postby Daemian Lucifer » Sun Nov 08, 2015 3:01 am

One of the biggest,most important,huge rule when writing fanfic is:Never make the main hero dumber than they are just so your character can seem smarter.These two episodes fail at that spectacularly.

Also dont use teen angst as your main driving plot,unless you are making a show about teens.Its just annoying and full of stupid.

The glasses are still stupid.Pointing out that they are stupid and continuing to use them is even stupider.

I liked the boxes though.And the 15 times.Though it has some rather....unfortunate implications.
Steve C

Re: Doctor Who?

Postby Steve C » Sun Nov 08, 2015 11:33 pm

It was two hours written around a speech. It was a really good speech, and well delivered. The speech was one of the high points of Doctor Who as a whole. The ending after it worked too. It is a shame that everything before it fell flat. It just didn't work on any level. Well, excluding the level where every character and every motivation is brain dead stupid.

Superb climax and dénouement though.
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Ringwraith

Re: Doctor Who?

Postby Ringwraith » Mon Nov 09, 2015 12:00 am

I'll admit I'm a sucker for letting Peter Capaldi spend several minutes shouting.
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4th Dimension

Re: Doctor Who?

Postby 4th Dimension » Mon Nov 09, 2015 7:59 am

Sooo, skip the first 20-30 minutes of the episode. Because frankly I don't think I have it in me to again be bored for 40+ minutes like in the last episode.
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Daemian Lucifer

Re: Doctor Who?

Postby Daemian Lucifer » Mon Nov 09, 2015 8:41 am

Lightweight.But here,if you want,just the speech.Though not the best quality.
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Daemian Lucifer

Re: Doctor Who?

Postby Daemian Lucifer » Sun Nov 15, 2015 12:09 am

Now this,this is a nice one.The correct mix of horror,humor and mystery.And in the end...its still not the end.I wonder when this will come back to resolve itself.
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Daemian Lucifer

Re: Doctor Who?

Postby Daemian Lucifer » Sun Nov 22, 2015 1:58 am

After an hour of futile attempts at quitting voiding of the legacy*,I managed to make a pause in order to watch the new doctor who episode.Aannd my verdict is....I made the right call.Because this,this was great.Hopefully,the next two episodes dont screw the pooch,because this ending hinges on it.

Massive spoilers ahead,dont read unless youve seen the episode completely.I am serious.

It will be the first time after decades that a companion has died,and clara was a much more established companion than katarina.So if Jenna Coleman is credited in the last episode because she appears in a memory of a kind,or in video form,or something like that,this will be a great season.If she is credited because she is brought back to life,in whatever way,it will plummet sooooo low.

*Just this one cinematic...just to start this mission and save...just to mop this mission...just to talk to everyone on the ship...just this one cinematic...Starcraft is my crack:(
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Daemian Lucifer

Re: Doctor Who?

Postby Daemian Lucifer » Mon Nov 30, 2015 7:53 pm

So they want to cram all of the time travel tropes in this season,it seems.They did the loop,they did the paradox,they did the sisyphus.What are they left with?

And while Im glad that they are sticking to their decision from the previous episode,Im slightly worried with the introduction of the hybrid.Because,if you are familiar with the movie,...well,you would know why that would be a very baaaad idea.
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Wide And Nerdy

Re: Doctor Who?

Postby Wide And Nerdy » Tue Dec 01, 2015 4:38 pm

I'm looking forward to this. I watch this show on Netflix and the last season did seem a step up from the Matt Smith era.

I know that the Doctor can be a bit of a Columbo using bumbling to obfuscate his intelligence but with Smith it seemed like they were portraying him as someone who couldn't tie his shoes without Amy there to help him.

With Capaldi he seems more grounded and at least there's the hint that something is missing. He's past his allotment of regenerations and it seems like he didn't come back quite right, so its a little more forgivable that he's so dependent on Clara. And just when I think the message is coming off a little too "even the most intelligent guy in the universe is clueless without a woman" they bring in a Rory or a Pink who is just as grounded and competent when given the chance. I really really liked Rory.

And the Mistress plot was great. Nice use of regen to sneak in the old foe, nice build up, and the afterlife plot was fascinating. Its gives the villainous plot a wonderfully grand sense of scale and clever usage of time travel.

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